Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Help with printing with specific plastic filaments.
AustBots
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2015 5:07 pm

Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by AustBots » Fri Nov 20, 2015 11:56 pm

I have been trying to print on a Mini with Alloy 910. Yuk!!! The attached photo shows that the surface is gooey (is there an official term for this?) I have tried head temps from 245 to 260 and bed temps from 45 to 100. You can see that it is warping badly and that it peels straight off the bed. I have tried UHU and PVA in different thicknesses to no avail.

I have 3 lulzbot printers and have had no issues with ABS, but we need some strength in some parts. Even though they look as ugly as hell, the Alloy 910 parts are fantastically strong.

Has anyone got some photos of good Alloy 910 prints? If so, what is the magic?
Attachments
alloy910.jpg

joshuanapoli
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:10 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by joshuanapoli » Sat Nov 21, 2015 2:29 pm

I've had very good results with Alloy 910 and a TAZ 5 printer. I keep the filament in a "dry box" with desiccant and feed the filament to the printer through a small hole in the box. I'd guess that wet filament might be your problem, but I've never seen it that bad.

The bed temperature has a minor affect on bed adhesion. I spread a puddle of diluted (5:1) Elmer's glue (PVA) over the PEI and evaporate the water. Taulman recommends 45C bed temperature, which works fine for me. Lulzbot recommends 100C, which also works well. The higher temperature will yellow the bottom of the part if the print time is long (12 hours or so). Parts with large contact area to the plate are easier to remove if the temperature is raised to about 80C. I think that the higher temperature softens the PVA and makes the part more flexible. But the higher temperature is more dangerous for the skin on your hands...

High extruder temperature can cause the material to yellow. Low temperature (below 245C) will "under-extrude" unless you calibrate the flow/esteps. I think that 245C is a good temperature.
Attachments
test-7.jpg

AustBots
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2015 5:07 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by AustBots » Tue Feb 02, 2016 6:10 am

That print looks brilliant.

Thank's for the advice. Yes, I think you are right about the moisture. I have done what you suggested and have a box with silica gel. That has solved the bubbling. thanks. I am still struggling with adhesion and warping.

ScottW
Posts: 461
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:00 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by ScottW » Tue Feb 02, 2016 11:01 am

AustBots wrote: ... I am still struggling with adhesion and warping.
I did not find the UHU to provide an adequate bond, especially with small parts (i.e., low surface area) they peeled up more often than not. I had better luck with the "Elmer's Washable Disappearing Purple School Glue" sticks.

C_Duncan
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2016 7:26 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by C_Duncan » Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:14 pm

@joshuanapoli

WOW great results.

dchincom
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 2:04 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by dchincom » Mon Feb 29, 2016 8:16 pm

ScottW wrote:
AustBots wrote: ... I am still struggling with adhesion and warping.
I did not find the UHU to provide an adequate bond, especially with small parts (i.e., low surface area) they peeled up more often than not. I had better luck with the "Elmer's Washable Disappearing Purple School Glue" sticks.
I have the Mini, did you just run the glue stick on the plain glass surface? Or did you have some kind of surface already on top of the heated glass?

CheeseJam
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2015 6:21 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by CheeseJam » Wed Mar 02, 2016 11:48 am

dchincom wrote:
ScottW wrote:
AustBots wrote: ... I am still struggling with adhesion and warping.
I did not find the UHU to provide an adequate bond, especially with small parts (i.e., low surface area) they peeled up more often than not. I had better luck with the "Elmer's Washable Disappearing Purple School Glue" sticks.
I have the Mini, did you just run the glue stick on the plain glass surface? Or did you have some kind of surface already on top of the heated glass?
The Mini has a PEI surface on top of the glass, so just put the glue right on top of that. If you for some reason you took the PEI surface off, the glue directly on the glass should work too.

ScottW
Posts: 461
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:00 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by ScottW » Wed Mar 02, 2016 6:11 pm

dchincom wrote:
ScottW wrote:
AustBots wrote: ... I am still struggling with adhesion and warping.
I did not find the UHU to provide an adequate bond, especially with small parts (i.e., low surface area) they peeled up more often than not. I had better luck with the "Elmer's Washable Disappearing Purple School Glue" sticks.
I have the Mini, did you just run the glue stick on the plain glass surface? Or did you have some kind of surface already on top of the heated glass?
I used the Glue Stick on the PEI.

Nylon (910) simply won't stick to the PEI. Common Glue Stick contains PVA, which sticks to both Nylon and PEI, so it makes a good interface layer between them.

Once you've finished your print and removed it, the Glue Stick residue is water soluble and can be easily removed from the PEI with a wet cloth.

suntorn
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:14 am

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by suntorn » Sat Mar 05, 2016 7:31 am

Keep at it! Taulman alloy 910 prints ate some of the strongest and cleanest looking prints. Although I can achieve the same with most any material. Surprisingly my pla prints ate the worst looking lol.
Attachments
20160229_225848.jpg
20160229_225820.jpg

AustBots
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2015 5:07 pm

Re: Alloy 910 Warping and Messy

Post by AustBots » Wed Mar 23, 2016 5:07 pm

Hi All,

Thanks for the advice. I have now conquered printing alloy 910. The tricks are;

1) Moisture - the filament must be stored in a sealed container with desicant (the stuff that absorbs moisture). ANY moisture in your filament will result in steam bubbles that help lift the nylon off the plate. This means that you have to cut your filament and store after every print. Even a couple of hours in air will make a difference.
2) Plate temperature 45 degrees celcius, hote end at 245 degrees celcius.
3) UHU does not work. You need a layer of pure PVA wood glue. At tis stage, I have to replace it after every print, but am working on it.

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