TAZ 6, Slop?

A forum dedicated to the stock LulzBot TAZ 3D Printer
pyrokld
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:57 pm

TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by pyrokld » Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:22 pm

I've been noticing more and more some really pronounced banding in my prints. In the attached picture I have some good examples. These were all printed with PolyLite PLA, first three were using the provided cura "quick print" profile and the last three on "high detail" It doesn't seem to matter which settings/speeds I use and it doesn't seem to follow any regular pattern like it's a z-axis issue. I find the same bands using both the stock .5mm nozzle print head and with a .3mm nozzle tool head I built myself, though much less pronounced with the .3mm tool head. Also the bands seem to be around the entire part for the whole layer, not just one particular side or the other.

Right now I'm just looking for other things to try or suggestions from the community on if I can make this better on my own, if this is just how it should be, or if I should get support involved.

So far I've done the following:
Tightened up both the x and y-axis belts.
Ensured x-axis is level to bed and top of frame.
Greased z-axis lead screws.
Checked all issues in service bulletins (no heatsink on drivers, frame square, etc).
Measured all filaments I use over several meters to check consistency and update values if needed.
Calibrate e-steps, within a mm or two of 100mm with idler tensioned using provided jig files (both with jig between washers and between thumbscrew heads and idler).
Tried just flat out printing slower.

Things I've observed:
I can wiggle the tool head a little bit, but it takes quite a bit of force, I don't think that normal printing movement would be able to wobble it much.
The bed does seem to have a bit of play, but as with the tool head it seems to take a fair amount of force.
Attachments
IMG_1548.JPG

DarrylS
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:41 pm

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by DarrylS » Mon Apr 24, 2017 3:09 pm

Remove the Head and check all the screws and nuts, I found some were missing and some nearly falling out!

pyrokld
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:57 pm

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by pyrokld » Mon Apr 24, 2017 5:09 pm

DarrylS wrote:Remove the Head and check all the screws and nuts, I found some were missing and some nearly falling out!
Thanks, good call. Snugged up all the x-carriage nuts, some were not quite tight, but not sure if they were really loose either. Also did the Y-axis bushing and belt mounts for good measure. Thanks again for the tip!

pyrokld
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:57 pm

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by pyrokld » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:14 pm

Well this tip and a couple of cold pulls, where I found a piece of metal brush wire in the nozzle that must have come from the brass brush I cleaned my hobbed bolt out with a while back did improve things quite a bit, but I'm still getting a pretty regular repeating pattern of bands, even at really slow speeds. One of those Benchy's was even printed at 50% FR.

At this point I'm starting to lean towards maybe the lead screws? Any more tips or is it time for me to move on to official support help? Working in support position myself I really don't want to get them involved until I've tried just about everything I can on my own.
Attachments
unnamed.jpg

kmanley57
Posts: 1111
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2015 3:53 pm

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by kmanley57 » Sat Apr 29, 2017 8:39 am

I would contact them. You should not have that much banding in your prints. Inspect ALL the printed plastic parts to make sure none are cracked. Idler, extruder, mounts, etc.
I will express my CRAZY ideas at any time! So you have been warned. None of my opinions are Lulzbots and can be wrong at any second.

Siropoly
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri May 19, 2017 7:36 am

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by Siropoly » Fri May 19, 2017 7:46 am

So I am in the same boat here, see the attached pictures. Brand new Taz 6, 1 week old today, and has never printed with out this level of banding or worse. Contacted support, have gone through all sorts of troubleshooting steps and have even more to go through. So far nothing has worked. Now I have noticed that my x and y axis are not quite "Smooth" in their movement, but nothing is loose or out of wack that I can see. Also in two of the attached there is a corner that you can see the layers are off on either the x or the y axis every other step. If anyone else here has gone through this same sort of issue I would be greatly interested in hearing what resolved it for you.
Attachments
IMG_20170519_094012.jpg
IMG_20170519_094009.jpg
IMG_20170519_093848.jpg
IMG_20170519_093837.jpg

pyrokld
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:57 pm

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by pyrokld » Sun May 21, 2017 10:11 am

Siropoly wrote:So I am in the same boat here, see the attached pictures. Brand new Taz 6, 1 week old today, and has never printed with out this level of banding or worse. Contacted support, have gone through all sorts of troubleshooting steps and have even more to go through. So far nothing has worked. Now I have noticed that my x and y axis are not quite "Smooth" in their movement, but nothing is loose or out of wack that I can see. Also in two of the attached there is a corner that you can see the layers are off on either the x or the y axis every other step. If anyone else here has gone through this same sort of issue I would be greatly interested in hearing what resolved it for you.
I still have my banding on all of my prints and have even gone as far as removing the Z-axis rods to make sure they weren't bent. I'm at a point with support where they want me to mail it in, and I am debating if I want to spend the 90 dollars to ship it to them for repair or replacement or keep trying. My first one was much worse, but was able to just exchange through Amazon for free because it was within the first 30 days, but with this one I had the nozzle break off the extruder and ended up waiting past the 30 day Amazon return for them to send me a new extruder.

These are my prints over the past two weeks working with support (in chronological order), starting to think this is as good as it's going to get with the stock design. These are using two different extruders too, my stock on and a .3mm one I put together myself.
Attachments
IMG_1595.JPG

Siropoly
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri May 19, 2017 7:36 am

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by Siropoly » Wed May 24, 2017 7:46 am

pyrokld wrote:
Siropoly wrote:So I am in the same boat here, see the attached pictures. Brand new Taz 6, 1 week old today, and has never printed with out this level of banding or worse. Contacted support, have gone through all sorts of troubleshooting steps and have even more to go through. So far nothing has worked. Now I have noticed that my x and y axis are not quite "Smooth" in their movement, but nothing is loose or out of wack that I can see. Also in two of the attached there is a corner that you can see the layers are off on either the x or the y axis every other step. If anyone else here has gone through this same sort of issue I would be greatly interested in hearing what resolved it for you.
I still have my banding on all of my prints and have even gone as far as removing the Z-axis rods to make sure they weren't bent. I'm at a point with support where they want me to mail it in, and I am debating if I want to spend the 90 dollars to ship it to them for repair or replacement or keep trying. My first one was much worse, but was able to just exchange through Amazon for free because it was within the first 30 days, but with this one I had the nozzle break off the extruder and ended up waiting past the 30 day Amazon return for them to send me a new extruder.

These are my prints over the past two weeks working with support (in chronological order), starting to think this is as good as it's going to get with the stock design. These are using two different extruders too, my stock on and a .3mm one I put together myself.
pyrokld, I am right here with you. I too got mine from amazon and luckily am still within the 30 day window, this is week two. I completely feel that this printer was just badly beaten during shipping and something has shifted or broken that I can not seem to find or fix. Clearly the demo print that came with the printer was perfect, and everything I've printed since getting it has been layer misstep. I too went to the point of taking apart the z axis and checking the bearings, printed parts, couplers, tightened all of the belts, x axis rods and z axis rods/screws to see if they are bent. The attached are two prints, after rebuild, were ran separately but with no tuning between prints. If you look the layer lines are inconsistent in where the missteps take place. I also made a bone fish and the layer missteps are not consistent across the bones (let me know if you want a picture of it, a pretty cool print). This leads me to think something other than the Z axis is having issues. Could be slop in the x axis or the head of the printer. Weird though that this design would kick out a perfect test print and then not be able to get the layers to line up at all after shipping.... I'd really hate to return this as I like the printer, just wish it could print consistently....
Attachments
IMG_20170524_083919.jpg

pyrokld
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:57 pm

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by pyrokld » Wed May 24, 2017 8:01 am

Siropoly wrote:
pyrokld wrote:
Siropoly wrote:So I am in the same boat here, see the attached pictures. Brand new Taz 6, 1 week old today, and has never printed with out this level of banding or worse. Contacted support, have gone through all sorts of troubleshooting steps and have even more to go through. So far nothing has worked. Now I have noticed that my x and y axis are not quite "Smooth" in their movement, but nothing is loose or out of wack that I can see. Also in two of the attached there is a corner that you can see the layers are off on either the x or the y axis every other step. If anyone else here has gone through this same sort of issue I would be greatly interested in hearing what resolved it for you.
I still have my banding on all of my prints and have even gone as far as removing the Z-axis rods to make sure they weren't bent. I'm at a point with support where they want me to mail it in, and I am debating if I want to spend the 90 dollars to ship it to them for repair or replacement or keep trying. My first one was much worse, but was able to just exchange through Amazon for free because it was within the first 30 days, but with this one I had the nozzle break off the extruder and ended up waiting past the 30 day Amazon return for them to send me a new extruder.

These are my prints over the past two weeks working with support (in chronological order), starting to think this is as good as it's going to get with the stock design. These are using two different extruders too, my stock on and a .3mm one I put together myself.
pyrokld, I am right here with you. I too got mine from amazon and luckily am still within the 30 day window, this is week two. I completely feel that this printer was just badly beaten during shipping and something has shifted or broken that I can not seem to find or fix. Clearly the demo print that came with the printer was perfect, and everything I've printed since getting it has been layer misstep. I too went to the point of taking apart the z axis and checking the bearings, printed parts, couplers, tightened all of the belts, x axis rods and z axis rods/screws to see if they are bent. The attached are two prints, after rebuild, were ran separately but with no tuning between prints. If you look the layer lines are inconsistent in where the missteps take place. I also made a bone fish and the layer missteps are not consistent across the bones (let me know if you want a picture of it, a pretty cool print). This leads me to think something other than the Z axis is having issues. Could be slop in the x axis or the head of the printer. Weird though that this design would kick out a perfect test print and then not be able to get the layers to line up at all after shipping.... I'd really hate to return this as I like the printer, just wish it could print consistently....
Yep, your prints look just like mine, and I love the bone fish for dialing in my z-offset since you have some real close lines, but they shuoldn't connect.

Mine is on it's way to Aleph for repair/replacement. Might be best to just exchange through amazon and take another shot with one from there and if that one still isn't up to par get one directly. I'll update once I get mine repaired or replaced and have a chance to print some tests.

Siropoly
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri May 19, 2017 7:36 am

Re: TAZ 6, Slop?

Post by Siropoly » Wed May 24, 2017 8:28 am

That's completely fair, we could have just gotten the bad apples. I'm sure it happens. I'll followup with support and see if there is anything else that they recommend. Otherwise I will follow you on the return and post updates once I have my new one.

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