TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

A forum dedicated to the stock LulzBot TAZ 3D Printer
pyocham
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Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:02 pm

TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by pyocham » Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:15 am

Hi All,

I hope you will be able to help me out with something. I have a TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 printer head. I have the firmware flashed to a TAZ 5. The everything seems to be functioning well enough in Repetier-Host but the print quality is quite bad. My question is should I flash the firmware back to a TAZ 3?

Also, I suspect that the PLA filament profile (Slic3r) and Printer setup profile on Repetier-Host both need to be reconfigured. I had a volunteer 3D printer wizard custom configure the profiles but it is obvious that they still need some reconfiguring. I have been looking without success for some pre-configured profiles for which I can just upload to Repetier-Host. Does anyone know or have something like that? I am really close to getting this somewhat modified TAZ 3 back up and running again so I can print out larger objects.

Thanks!

Best,

Phillip

Brent.I
Aleph Objects | LulzBot
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Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by Brent.I » Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:11 am

pyocham wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:15 am
I have the firmware flashed to a TAZ 5
One thing to note, is the Z axis drive system is different between the two systems. If you are getting gaps in your vertical layers, it will likely be due to the Z steps. The TAZ 5 uses 1600steps/mm, and the TAZ 3 uses 800steps/mm in Z. You can update this through the LCD in configuration. (Be sure to store settings afterwards) If you are using the TAZ 5 Aerostruder FW and Tool Head (along with the added harness for the dedicated cooling fan,) that is the only adjustment you should need to make. (Both are 24v systems, manual leveling, same bed size.) If you want to go a step further, you can run PID tunes on your hot end and bed, as the PSU between the machines is different. (May speed up heating times)

As for slicing options, we would highly recommend Cura 3.2.21: lulzbot.com/cura

Set up the machine for a TAZ 5 Aerostruder Tool Head, and save the gcode to your SD card and print off the LCD screen. As the tool head is the same, the profiles should be much easier to tweak compared to another slicer we have not tested.

We hope this helps!

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piercet
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Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by piercet » Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:13 am

The Taz 3 out of the box doesn't have the wires for the fans. Did you add those in? there is a procedure here that shows where the wires need to go, then you have to alter the firmware https://ohai.lulzbot.com/project/taz3-h ... cessories/ If you are still using the Taz 3 threaded rod, the thread pitch is much different than the Taz 5 leadscrews so everything would be squished if you didn't edit in the Z steps to the Taz 3 value. If I were in that position i'd complete the conversion to 5 spec, its a much better print setup.

pyocham
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:02 pm

Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by pyocham » Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:44 am

I am using this single extruder: https://www.lulzbot.com/store/tool-head ... ol-head-v2

I changed Z steps to 800. The print quality is quite horrid even using Cura. It seems to me that the extruder is often dragging across whatever I am trying to print and the print is coming out very squished and messy.

Thanks!

pyocham
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:02 pm

Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by pyocham » Sat Aug 18, 2018 10:23 am

piercet wrote:
Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:13 am
The Taz 3 out of the box doesn't have the wires for the fans. Did you add those in? there is a procedure here that shows where the wires need to go, then you have to alter the firmware https://ohai.lulzbot.com/project/taz3-h ... cessories/ If you are still using the Taz 3 threaded rod, the thread pitch is much different than the Taz 5 leadscrews so everything would be squished if you didn't edit in the Z steps to the Taz 3 value. If I were in that position i'd complete the conversion to 5 spec, its a much better print setup.
I have the firmware set to a TAZ 5 with the Z-steps now 800. The prints are coming out quite messy but less squished. It seems like the extruder is dragging across the prints I am doing. Any ideas?

kmanley57
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Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by kmanley57 » Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:57 pm

If you could post a picture of the rod connected to the top of a Z motor would help.
I will express my CRAZY ideas at any time! So you have been warned. None of my opinions are Lulzbots and can be wrong at any second.

mschmotz
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 6:50 am

Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by mschmotz » Mon Aug 27, 2018 12:54 pm

Hey guys,

Hate to interrupt this thread but I have a very similar problem. Recently bought a Taz 3 on ebay and did all the necessary upgrades to Taz 5. I flashed the rambo board with the Taz 5 firmware but the prints are coming out like crap as well.

When I say I upgraded to Taz 5, what I replaced was the Z-axis to lead screws, x-axis plates, tool head to hexagon hotend, and build plate with PEI. I figured all I would have to do was flash to Taz 5 firmware, but after doing so my prints just look horrible compared to my other 3 Taz 5/6s.

I believe we both may be having the same issue? If anything, you arnt alone with having print issues.

Here is an incomplete Benchy I tired printing.

Image

Thanks

Galadriel
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Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by Galadriel » Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:20 am

mschmotz wrote:
Mon Aug 27, 2018 12:54 pm
Hey guys,

Hate to interrupt this thread but I have a very similar problem. Recently bought a Taz 3 on ebay and did all the necessary upgrades to Taz 5. I flashed the rambo board with the Taz 5 firmware but the prints are coming out like crap as well.

When I say I upgraded to Taz 5, what I replaced was the Z-axis to lead screws, x-axis plates, tool head to hexagon hotend, and build plate with PEI. I figured all I would have to do was flash to Taz 5 firmware, but after doing so my prints just look horrible compared to my other 3 Taz 5/6s.

I believe we both may be having the same issue? If anything, you arnt alone with having print issues.

Here is an incomplete Benchy I tired printing.

Image

Thanks
It looks like there may be a couple things at play in regards to the print quality here. It looks like your first layer is probably a bit too squished based on how indistinct the writing on the bottom of the Benchy is and the bit of elephant footing that is present around your bottom layer. Here is a photo showing what a good first layer will look like based on squish:
1st_layer_adhesion.jpg
To adjust your Z-offset I would start by making sure the bed is well leveled, since you just did several modifications on the printer. Leveling the bed on a TAZ can be a little tricky until you get the hang of it. The most common issue new customers run into is making too large of adjustments to the corner pieces. In order to have a good starting point, lets reset your bed. You are going to want to compress the corner springs to 3/4ths their maximum position. The easiest way to do this is to place your finger underneath the aluminum build plate, and tighten all for corners until the screws are sticking out to the same length. This gives a base starting point that allows for tightening and loosening on all 4 corners.

Once the bed is reset we need to set the initial Z height before making any corner adjustments. Measure the distance from the aluminum plate to the lower horizontal smooth rod of the X axis on both the right and left hand side. This should be equidistant. If an adjustment is required, turn off your printer and manually turn one of the threaded rods up or down to make the left and right hand side equal. Using a business card between the glass plate and the nozzle, home your printer. When it has finished moving, you should feel a slight tension on the card from the nozzle and the bed. If this pressure is not present, or is more than slight you will need to adjust your Z axis thumb screw and re-home. Once this is set in the home position, we can test the other three corners.

Turn off your printer or disable your stepper motors to allow manual movement of the bed and tool head. Move the tool head and the bed to test all 4 corners approximately 1 inch in from the sides. You should feel the same slight tension on the card on all four spots. If needed, adjust the bed corners to achieve this. The bed corners work much in the same way as replacing a car tire. You will want to make small adjustments as changing one corner will affect the other three. The business card it just a quick set in order to get your bed calibration print to stick. Fine adjustments will be made after the bed calibration print to achieve the proper height as highlighted in step 5 of your quick start guide.

Here is a helpful link to the online instructions on bed leveling: https://www.lulzbot.com/support/taz-bed-leveling

Here is another helpful link to that same procedure but in video form: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdB8jbXFfns


It also looks like you might have some over extrusion, I am thinking this will be due to the print temperature being a bit higher than necessary. What filament and settings were you using when you printed this? When you flashed your firmware up to a Taz 5 were you using the newest version of Cura? If so did you make sure to adjust the E-Steps afterwards to make sure they were correct for your extruder? If you are uncertain if the E-Steps are correct we have a guide for calibrating your extruder which you can use to verify that you are extruding correctly: https://ohai.lulzbot.com/workflow/fine- ... libration/

mschmotz
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 6:50 am

Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by mschmotz » Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:05 pm

Hi Galadriel,

Thank you for spending time to replay back!

I will try your suggestions tonight but one thing I noticed is that the dead center of my bed is higher in the z axis then the rest of the bed. I actually first ran the calibration print shown in your video (the curvy X figure) and the outside edges looked "Perfect" on your chart, but the center was "Low" or "Too Low" when running. Any thoughts on what could cause that? I cant imagine the glass bending.

thanks!

Brent.I
Aleph Objects | LulzBot
Posts: 419
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:21 am

Re: TAZ 3 with TAZ 5 Extruder

Post by Brent.I » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:03 pm

Chances are what you are seeing, is due to gravity in the center of the X axis travel path. Your tool head is dipping down, opposed to your glass bowing up. This was mitigated in the past with a large initial layer height of 0.425mm. This will allow good adhesion across the surface of the bed while maintaining tolerance. (This dip is ~0.1mm from our testing) This is one the reasons we went to the 12mm X axis rods on later generation printers.

You should be good to go if all 4 of your corners on the calibration print look good!

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