White ABS Delamination

Hey all,

I am printing with a fresh spool of white ABS lulzbot 3mm filament. I was using natural ABS prior.

I am experiencing delamination and curling up from the bed worse than on the natural. My heated bed is still at 85C / hot end at 230C and slicing the same profile as with the natural and I have a layer of acetone slurry applied to the PET tape.

Of course without printing the same models in a more controlled environment I can’t be for sure if it is the filament. Regardless I am curious if anyone else has used lulzbot’s white ABS and had to adjust any slicing settings.

Possibly related I replaced my PET tape and did a poor job of getting all the bubbles out. I imagine I will have to pull this piece up and reapply another sheet and be more vigilant of the bubbles.

here’s my slic3r profile:

; generated by Slic3r 0.9.10b on 2013-07-09 at 11:31:18

; layer_height = .25
; perimeters = 4
; top_solid_layers = 4
; bottom_solid_layers = 5
; fill_density = 0.2
; perimeter_speed = 95
; infill_speed = 110
; travel_speed = 200
; nozzle_diameter = 0.35
; filament_diameter = 2.89
; extrusion_multiplier = 1
; perimeters extrusion width = 0.39mm
; infill extrusion width = 0.39mm
; solid infill extrusion width = 0.39mm
; top infill extrusion width = 0.39mm

are you saying this does not happen with other material, like other colors of ABS?


either way, use lulzjuice, and try to print one part at a time instead of all in one group, so that there is less time for the parts to cool down between layers. Also increasing the brim should help.

Also, if you can make an enclosure to help trap the heat and keep out drafts, that will help. I used the box my printer came in, and it helped the cracking. see here: https://forum.lulzbot.com/t/hope-you-kept-your-taz-box-simple-heated-enclosure/170/1

I have also had problems with the white ABS. I haven’t had any of those troubles with the color changing ABS, glow in the dark, or natural ABS. So some additive in the white changes something and we need to figure out what to change in the settings. I am going to try a little more/less heat on the hotend. Also faster/slower printing speeds to see. Of coarse when I run out of white ABS I doubt I will be buying it again, just stick with natural.

That’s splitting due to ABS shrinkage. Use an enclosure or use a tall skirt to alleviate it. It will also help with the part adhesion.

I’ll try hacking up an enclosure.

I didn’t have this problem so badly with the natural. Unfortunately lullzbot was out of natural when I ordered :stuck_out_tongue:

White was also a poor choice for priming, as now I can’t see as easily which spots on my part are primed / unprimed :stuck_out_tongue:

Try doing a skirt of 999 height a few mm from the part. It will help trap air in and keep it from warping.

I haven’t had much luck with the skirt in the past. in my experience the skirt tends to delaminate / peel off the bed thus causing an additional set of problems.

Make the skirt more than one perimeter thick. We now routinely use tall skirts on more problematic parts.

I use a skirt all the time, never turn it off, unless model is really close to edge of the bed and I have never had a problem with it coming off or getting in the way, the skirt should be at least 4mm away from your model and if you are doing a tall skirt, then make it more parameters and a little further away.

So I put a box over my printer and I’m still having (worse) delamination. I understand this part is fairly large but not having a good time here :\

the last picture is when I tried printing earlier with thinner walls, and then just sort of took the layers apart.

also some smaller objects that show delamination.

; generated by Slic3r 0.9.10b on 2013-07-28 at 14:02:26

; layer_height = .25
; perimeters = 4
; top_solid_layers = 4
; bottom_solid_layers = 5
; fill_density = 0.2
; perimeter_speed = 80
; infill_speed = 110
; travel_speed = 200
; nozzle_diameter = 0.35
; filament_diameter = 2.89
; extrusion_multiplier = 1
; perimeters extrusion width = 0.39mm
; infill extrusion width = 0.39mm
; solid infill extrusion width = 0.39mm
; top infill extrusion width = 0.39mm
platform_1_NW.stl (74.3 KB)

I have had problems with the white ABS too. It has to be something that is added when they make it white. Natural and some other colors don’t do this. Increasing/decreasing the heat usually gets it to work, but waste some filament figuring out the temp setting.

Here’s a quick update. I got some ultimachine 3mm natural abs in the other day and have tried printing similar parts. I’ve had just as bad cracking / delamination as the white. It seems the size of the parts and slicing (?) are to blame, not the filament. Thin walled parts with little room for infill are especially troublesome.

Also, I’ve printed smaller parts with the lulzbot white with great success. I think lower layer heights have helped also.

I suppose the next step is breaking my parts up into even smaller sub parts.

what is your print temperature? I have upped mine a little and that did help.

see here: http://reprap.org/wiki/Print_Troubleshooting_Pictorial_Guide#Too_cold_2

Note it says “Print perimeter surrounding skirt full height of part to keep the heat in.” as one fix…

The tall skirt is the easiest thing to do to prevent the model from splitting. It’s easy and has worked well for me.

My print temps are 230 hot end and 85 bed.

I am having success with the skirt. However, the skirt is also delaminating. This isn’t a problem unless the whole skirt splits off and the printer starts to print in the air. How many loops do you generally run on the skirt? The last print where this problem happened I had 3 loops.

__

BTW, I am printing ABS at 238…every degree helps.

I’ve been having these same issues with all colors of my abs. I’m excited to see what we learn from this.

I see that your perimeters are running at 80mm/s and your infill is at 110mm/s. Have you tried slowing down some? I print a tad faster than that but I also run the nozzle at 240-245°C and the bed at 90°C and I have it in an enclosure. I would guess that the head moving around that fast is creating lots of air turbulence and it is contributing to the delimitation. I would print the skirt 5-10 rows thick. I also put a big (20 row) brim on most of my parts.

Printing ABS with the Hexagon hot end is much more reliable- printing at 240-245 helps significantly with splitting.